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 Topic  |
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Jeepbuddy
USA
44 Posts
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 Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:21:08 AM
I figure that if the churches pulled out all the stops, spent tens of thousands of dollars,pushed all their members to vote, and only won by 49 votes, it was a pyrrhic victory at best. And, when you consider that the "yes" voters did practically nothing and lost by only 49 votes, the issue is still very much alive and will not go away. I suspect that this issue will be a prominent one in the next commissioner election. "We must scrupulously guard the civil rights and civil liberties of all citizens, whatever their background. We must remember that any oppression, any injustice, any hatred is a wedge designed to attack our civilization." FDR |
mad4martinis
USA
13730 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:21:50 AM
there was a post from rreed & then I replied & now it's gone. Admin?? are you doing something or am I just crazy?
**There is no truth except the truth that exists within you. Everything else is what someone is telling you**
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Admin
USA
1484 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:37:29 AM
We will generally leave a note when messages are removed for not complying with the Usage Policies.No actions have been taken this morning. P.S. At the bottom of pg 2 of this topic is a post by rmreed and replied to by mad4martinis.
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coosa creek
USA
39313 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 1:02:56 PM
Lamar told me he was afraid the first person killed in Union county in a DUI would be blamed on him.(This was before he was elected) I don't know why he would want to be commissioner again, it is too much stress!!
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Honoria
USA
50 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:10:23 PM
Oh, I know. Even if I listed names, addresses, where their tatoos are, where they go to catch fish and which Brave's player they like, someone would still claim I made it all up.I was just waiting for the responses. I figger that the loudest "NO you can't do THAT" could be from someone who frequents the bar. Or someone who knows someone who frequents the bar. Or it could be from someone who'd hate to see me behind bars . . . or worse. Funny how a person can get a DUI in another State and not have it show up in Georgia. Wonder how that works. Segues music please. Time to move on folks. Nothing to see here. Move along and enjoy the weekend. Keep in touch.
Honoria
and I am a she not a he
It is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not to deserve them.
Mark Twain (1835 - 1910) Edited by - Honoria on 07/20/2006 11:12:36 PM |
Hotdawg
USA
2357 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:12:10 PM
Well so much for "Dawgs Beerbarn and Hotwangs Shack" |
ShadowMan
USA
4158 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:24:37 PM
quote:
Funny how a person can get a DUI in another State and not have it show up in Georgia. Wonder how that works.
I'm not sure that's all that difficult. It's been a long time since I worked in state government, but the cooperation that was supposedly there between neighboring states regarding information sharing and such was done nowhere near as well as the politicians made it sound like. And if you went beyond neighboring states it was even less. Maybe, in the last ten years they've cleaned all that up and truly made DMV-type information borderless. I'm not holding my breath on it though. Shadow This is my kirttimukha |
Honoria
USA
50 Posts
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Posted - 07/20/2006 : 11:30:23 PM
quote:
Lamar told me he was afraid the first person killed in Union county in a DUI would be blamed on him.(This was before he was elected) I don't know why he would want to be commissioner again, it is too much stress!!
Who was the last person killed in Union County in a DUI? Check this out: http://www.unionsentinel.com/news/2006/0713/Community/015.html Scroll down to DUI 3rd offense Am I the only one seeing RED here??? They ticket a guy who has no license, you can bet he's not in this Country legally and they don't put his arse in the County Detention Center and call INS/Homeland Security?????? Scroll down a bit to DUI 1st offense Anyone else seeing RED besides me???? Scroll all the way down to the bottom of the page to DUI 2nd offense Who else will join me in seeing RED at yet another DUI???? WHY does law enforcement not throw their sorry arses in the hoose-gow? What are they waiting for? Wine, beer, liquor by the drink? Because I don't think that dog's gonna hunt for quite a while.
Honoria
The honored one in the family. It is better to deserve honors and not have them than to have them and not to deserve them.
Mark Twain (1835 - 1910) |
daughterofconfederate
USA
29728 Posts
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Posted - 07/21/2006 : 01:25:57 AM
Geez, I dont think I know the first one in that one (GLAD TOO) but I told yuns long ago we had the higher DUIs than Towns. WOW!
We make a living by what we get, we make a life by what we give.
Sir Winston Churchill
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wranger
94 Posts
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Posted - 07/21/2006 : 3:46:38 PM
The First Baptist Liqour license story is an old myth. No licenses have been issued although the commissioner would have the power to do so if he wanted too.
As far as the IRS is concerned, I don't know about that, but it wouldn't surprise me if that were true. Churches are usually
501 (c) 3 organizations, which means that they cannot engage in political advocacy as oppossed to 501 (c) 4 organizations. The churches formed a committee, but all the money they spent was put up by the churches. First Baptist for example allocated $15,000 from there budget to fight the initiative.
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coosa creek
USA
39313 Posts
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Posted - 07/21/2006 : 4:34:06 PM
He is right, that story has been around forever, the church does not have any liquor licenses.
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why
USA
2072 Posts
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Posted - 07/21/2006 : 4:34:27 PM
The alcohol issue wasn't political according to some I've talked to and I have the same opinion.They were not advancing a certain canidate or political party. Just my opinion, my law degree was back ordered at Sears. why |
Chris
USA
179 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 02:30:41 AM
quote:
The alcohol issue wasn't political according to some I've talked to and I have the same opinion.They were not advancing a certain canidate or political party.
But donating to a registered PAC (Political Action Committee) could be considered dabbling into local politics. The churches would have been much better off if they simply told their congregations where to mail their checks to help defeat the ordinance. Individual donations are okay under current campaign finance rules. Politics is not just about supporting a political party or candidate. Harold Lasswell said politics is simply the process of deciding who gets what, when, and how. This could have been perceived as a moral issue; but in order to stay simply a moral issue, no political process , such as voting, could have been involved. This became a power struggle between keeping Union County alcohol-free and making Union County a place where "the beer flows like wine." You may think it was too trivial to be a power issue, but then why should people spend $47,000 to defeat a trivial issue? This was indeed a political issue, just not in the conventional sense that you described in your post. Edited by - Chris on 07/22/2006 02:32:02 AM |
mad4martinis
USA
13730 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 07:03:04 AM
Good post Chris. I do think anytime you vote at a poll, it's political. How can it not be? Just this canidate happened to have the name "yes" & "no".**There is no truth except the truth that exists within you. Everything else is what someone is telling you** |
CaseyDoodleBug
USA
287 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 08:57:14 AM
While the churches actions regarding the alcohol referendum were certain "political," there were in no way risking their tax status with the IRS. The law is clear that promoting a "candidate" would be considered grounds for revocation of tax exempt status, but promoting a cause is not. It would be the same as churches standing against abortion, euthanasia or the death penalty. They have every right to take a stand on any moral issue and spend their money accordingly. Don't get me wrong, I disagree with the churches. There are so many needs in every community that, in my opinion, should be at the forefront of the Christian community's work - feeding the hungry, providing housing for the poor and elderly, education, etc., etc., etc. While many have said that churches do support these causes, think about what $48,000 could do to change one family's life. It could help to replace a home that burned or was flooded, support a family whose main provider is hurt or sick or provide the financial support necessary for a deserving young man or woman to obtain a college degree who would not otherwise be able to attend. It makes me sick to think about the number of children in this country that do without the basic necessities every day while well-meaning churches fight the evils of alcohol. DoodleBug |
coosa creek
USA
39313 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 10:04:05 AM
I do agree with you casey, I really think it was a waste of money. I doubt if the signs changed anyone's vote! It certainly had no influence on anyone that I know.
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Wildflower
USA
4528 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 10:09:55 AM
You expressed it well, Casey.Wildflower |
GrayEagle
USA
9966 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 10:17:07 AM
I see a lot to talk about the money the chruches gave to something they believe in and how "you" think it could be used better. How about the money the other side spent? Why aren't "you" talking about all the money spent by them? Before someone jumps into my case, I have no idea how much was spent by the "pro" supporters.But a more personal question, and I really don't want an answer, is what have YOU spent to help the poor, to help the animals, to help those who have lost their house for whatever reason. BTW, I am a Christian first and a Southern Baptist second, if I were there and could have voted, I would have voted "Yes". I have sorta stayed out of this for the most part, but this is what I have seen from reading all the comments: The Christians and Churches would have been and are being damned regardless of how the vote turned out. Time to move on. The vote is over (for now). All the anger on this topic seems to shows the passion of the subject. GrayEagle
"Don't go around saying the world owes you a living; the world owes you nothing; it was here first." Samuel Clemens Edited by - GrayEagle on 07/22/2006 10:18:29 AM |
nativelady
USA
11126 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 12:27:48 PM
Gray, Well said!The Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away, and for those who aren't aware of how churches use their money, it is used on all the "other" needs you all keep talking about. Now there are a few organizations here in the county that is a wee bit, ummm well they make their own money, I'll put it that way. But as for the Women's Shelter and the Pregnancy Crisis Center, Our church helps them VERY MUCH! We also give to the poor, and we give to the needy, and we give to those who are in need at Christmas. We adopt families, BIG FAMILIES, every year for Christmas! I am thankful that we have the monies to do this with. I am also thankful that we have the FREEDOM to so. "Christianity is not a religion; it is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ." |
CaseyDoodleBug
USA
287 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 1:11:59 PM
Gray:Your point is well made, however, there are several counter-points to your statement. First, I agree that the vote is over, done is done and the majority has spoken. I also don't believe it was defeated by the churches alone. There are those "NO" voters out there that don't want to see the growth and also those that appreciate being able to brown bag. Secondly, from a Biblical standpoint, there is a major difference (in my mind anyway) in how a private business or individual spends money that they work for and how a church spends its money. As far as I can tell, the Bible charges us to make an honest living and return the first 10% of our earnings to God. There is no charge as to what to do with the other 90%. The charge to churches is very different. Third, churches are given special exemptions under the tax code because they should not be in the "money-making" business. If they are, they loose that preferential treatment from the IRS. When they spend money, it is truly not their's to spend. It is money that was given to God by way of their parishioner's tithes and offerings. I'm not just speaking of one issue here, either. I would have the same problem with big, extravagant church buildings and any other unnecessary, frivolous item that many churches feel the need to purchase and/or engage in. I recognize that in spending the money in Blairsville, many individuals voted as to whether their church would participate or not and this is their right. It was God's money, entrusted to the church. Specific churches decided that doing God's work meant advertising against the sale of alcohol. I disagree with that. I'm not downing Southern Baptist or any other religion. If my own church asked me, as a member, to participate in the advertising campaign, I'd have voice vocal opposition. DoodleBug |
coosa creek
USA
39313 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 1:53:01 PM
Habitate for Humanity is trying to build a house for a family with 2 children in wheelchairs. $48,000 could have gone a long way in helping to build that house. The money was just plain wasted!!
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why
USA
2072 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 2:40:35 PM
Shuda, cudda, wodda...It's over and done with. It really doesn't matter what either sides money could have done somewhere else, you can't saw sawdust.Whats really funny is why anyone would run for anything on the local level when the cost of campaining is many times more than the office pays. Could some of them really have the best for the people in mind or are they running to keep the other party out of office?? why Edited by - why on 07/22/2006 2:41:06 PM |
Admin
USA
1484 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 3:17:29 PM
A post (plus one that referenced it) has been removed that violated our Usage Policies. For future postings, please read them to see what is allowed.
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nativelady
USA
11126 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 4:02:24 PM
No money was wasted. It wasn't done in vain. I imagine until people understand the concept rather than hiding behind the veil, they truely dont understand. And another thing, if everyone is so worried about where the money went, how it was spent, and all the other causes, why dont they let go of their THOUSANDS and help Habitat for Humanity and the other charitable causes. I mean let's face it, this money DIDNT BUY anything. We know that. I didn't buy a vote. It didn't buy it in here either. Wasted money is only in the eye of the person slinging the word. I think it's a waste of money to eat out every night. I think it's a waste of money to buy alcohol. This can go both ways. Habibitat is also looking for builders with the ability to build. Is anyone giving their time on here? I didnt think so!"Christianity is not a religion; it is a personal relationship with Jesus Christ." |
Wildflower
USA
4528 Posts
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Posted - 07/22/2006 : 4:09:17 PM
I think what Casey is trying to say is that it's these churches "Piorities" that seem so strange.Yes, they give money to other causes. But $48,000? I don't think anyone is saying they are "bad people" though. No doubt they really believed it was a high priority. I think all this just illustrates how differently we all approach the idea of what God wants us to do. Wildflower |
THE VOTING RESULTS/YES or NO
